Intro 0:01
Many aspire to reach the upper echelon of the healthcare industry, but few are able to successfully navigate the corporate ladder. C-Suite Partners sits down with international healthcare executives, asking the tough questions and unpacking the personalities of the top industry leaders. Welcome to the Boardroom.
Michael Murray 0:35
Ainsley, thank you so much for joining C-Suite Partners’ “In the Boardroom”. We’re here in lovely Jakarta. Could you tell the audience a little bit about what you’re doing here, your role and when you first moved here?
Ainsley Mann 0:45
Okay, thank you, Michael, and good to see you again. I’ve been in Jakarta for the best part of thirteen years, and actually multiple roles. But right now, my responsibility is to focus more on the business development for the Swire Group, government relations and support everything we’re trying to do in the healthcare sector. So that really involves me looking after stakeholder relations, whether it be shareholders, whether it be government, and supporting the teams on the ground.
Michael Murray 1:20
And when you were a younger man, finishing your studies, what was your intention for your career?
Ainsley Mann 1:25
So, when I grew up, I was fascinated by geography. I loved my Lego, so I went to study something called land economics, which was more focused on real estate urban planning. So that was, that was always my passion. I ended up becoming a chartered surveyor, which is like a property valuer. At the same time one of the reasons I ended up in Asia is my father did his national service in Malaysia. So, he always told me stories about his time there. So, I was always fascinated with this part of the world. So originally, when it came out, I ended up working in real estate and stayed here in Asia since 1989.
Michael Murray 2:08
How long did it take you to settle in? Because I know when I first came to the Southeast Asian marketplace, whether it’s Indonesia, Philippines, it was at least two to three years before I really understood what was going on, but also a little bit more accepted in the business community. Did you find that as well?
Ainsley Mann 2:25
Yeah, I think it depends on the country. So, when I left the UK, I backpacked for two years, so I actually spent quite a lot of time in this part of the world. My wife is from Indonesia. Built my house here 23 years ago. So, I’ve been coming to Indonesia on and off for a long period of time. One of the great things about Indonesia is people are very open, accessible. So, if you make the effort, it’s actually quite possible to develop a network relatively quickly, and I think that’s one of the great advantages of this country. The more you put into it, the more you get out of it.
Michael Murray 3:02
What do you feel are the greatest challenges in Southeast Asia in terms of whether it’s healthcare, whether it’s property compared to working, say in the UK or Australia?
Ainsley Mann 3:11
I think one of the biggest challenges here, particularly in Indonesia, is navigating regulations and making sense of them, and having to deal with all the different government stakeholders, because often the regulations from different ministries don’t always dovetail. So I find that one of the greatest challenges, and then trying to explain to our head office really how things are working, and trying to ensure that people don’t have a misinterpretation of what the reality is on the ground. I’m trying to keep a cool head sure to explain that, yep, things might not progress as originally planned, but we’re on the right track, and this is how we’re going to have to deal with the different situations.
Michael Murray 3:53
What do you think the qualities that matter for your 2ICs or executive underneath you to continue to perform in their roles. Is it resilience? Is it commercial acumen? What do you think it is?
Ainsley Mann 4:05
It’s a combination. But I think it’s important. I’m a foreigner here. I’m really the only foreigner in our operation. And typically the culture here, in a lot of places in Asia, is they look to the to the boss to make the decisions.
Michael Murray 4:20
Sure, sure.
Ainsley Mann 4:21
I like to delegate, and I like to encourage people to come to me with suggestions and, quite frankly, to tell me if I’m going down the wrong path. So, I think creating an atmosphere which is collegiate, people feel that they can approach me, can make suggestions and are welcome to have a very open and candid discussion. I think that’s important, because ultimately, I’m almost 60 – other people will be taking over you and you want to try and develop leaders below you, and I try to encourage them to do the same with their teams. So having an open work environment, in a collegiate work environment, I think it’s very important and to treat people with respect. I like to employ good people. So that’s not just expecting people to do as they’re told. It’s expecting people to contribute, encourage them to be innovative and encourage them to build teams at the same time.
Michael Murray 5:19
Makes total sense. And in terms of talent that come into organisations – we’ve been through it before. Everyone has seen someone who’s perfect on paper, interview really well, and then they get onboarded into the organisation and they’re not with you in six months. Where do you think that stems from? Do you think that’s an onboarding piece? Do you think that’s rigor around a process because you’re under pressure? What’s your views on that?
Ainsley Mann 5:45
I think you hit a good point. Typically, someone will go through an interview process, I might get half an hour, an hour with them. Is that sufficient to really get to know someone? Not necessarily, though I’m a great believer, in the first couple of minutes you can probably decide whether or not you think the personality or the person is going to fit into the team. But typically, in business, once you employ someone and onboard them, you don’t always apply a structured approach to reviews, understand what they’re doing, and there can be more science. There should be more science to that, and perhaps tools to help us, because a lot of it is ad hoc, and let’s be honest, that’s a lot of businesses show it that way, although you do annual reviews.
Michael Murray 6:34
Sure.
Ainsley Mann 6:35
It can be a more structured process to the onboarding, reviewing performance, understanding why things are not working so well. That would be great.
Michael Murray 6:43
Makes sense, makes sense. Just changing direction a bit, in terms of private capital, private equity, it’s starting to come into Southeast Asia. I’m seeing it more and more over the past three or four years. Do you think that’s influencing the way people do business in terms of the commercial outcomes? A little bit more focused on EBITDA rather than clinical outcomes? Are you seeing any of those trends?
Ainsley Mann 7:08
Absolutely. I mean, if I take to take the business we’re involved in, historically, the leadership wasn’t really focused on such metrics. At the end of the day, not just EBITDA profit, you need to get generated returns, and that requires accountability, top to bottom, and a proper structure whereby everyone is dancing to the same tune. So that’s one of the challenges, is to restructure an organisation where the where the goals are clear, the accountability is clear, and the people below you understand my accountability. We try and align with them. When I look at our business, that’s one of the biggest challenges, is making sure a large organisation and everyone is focusing on the same goals.
Michael Murray 8:00
Ainsley, thank you so much for taking time and being a part of “In the Boardroom” and look forward to seeing you soon.
Ainsley Mann 8:05
Pleasure. Okay.
